Boot problem with XFX GeForce 8600GT

[Kerry]

Boot problem with new XFX GeForce 8600GT (PVT84J-U1D4) on new MSI P35D3 MOBO.

I press the power-on button on the front of the case and the HDD LED and Power Switch LED come on.
The PS fan, the CPUFan, and the SysFan1 (case exhaust fan), start running. After two seconds the fans stop. Then after three more seconds the fans start and the monitor displays 4 lines of info about nVidia and immediately reverts to "No Signal". The fans stop. Then within three seconds the process repeats itself.

If I do nothing it keeps looping as described.

I’m able to boot into Vista Ultimate if I press the CMOS button, which brings up the following on the monitor:

CMOS setting Wrong
Date and Time setting wrong
Press F1 to run setup
Press F2 to load default values

I pressed F1 and entered the date and time and “Load Optimized Defaults” then pressed Save & Exit. It reboots and Vista Ultimate opens and I’m able to compute all day.

Then I shut down and try to reboot and I have to reset the CMOS button, enter BIOS and enter date and time, again. In other words BIOS doesn’t retain the settings.

I’ve followed all the steps recommended by members of the MSI HQ Forums. I’ve RMA’d the MOBO with same results. I’ve swapped the ram and run MemTest86 with no errors.

Someone suggested I remove the graphics card and boot, which I did as follows:

I plugged in the speakers, removed the XFX card and booted. The fans started and stopped within two seconds as before. It kept looping as before. Then I pressed the CMOS button and the board’s Status LEDs turned grn, off, grn, off, etc. and the HDD activity LED stops. I assumed the monitor would have displayed "CMOS setting Wrong Date and Time setting wrong Press F1 to run setup Press F2 to “Load default values" and so I pressed F2 and I could hear Windows boot chime while it booted into Vista. I turned off the PC by holding the case button in for 5 seconds and rebooted and again the sound of Windows chime indicating success. This was the first time ever (in at least 50 troubleshooting boot attempts) that a second boot didn’t require resetting the CMOS (even though the date and time were incorrect), and that the fans kept running after I pressed the start button. Then I plugged the XFX card back in and booted using the CMOS button and reset the date and time and then Vista opened. I closed windows and removed the card and tried starting. I was hoping that the BIOS would retain the date and time, etc. and that the removed card wouldn’t undo the BIOS settings but instead the fans stopped and I had to reset CMOS and enter the date and time. I repeated this process twice and got the same results. My other PC has a VGA card so I can’t use it to test the PCI-E card. My monitor has a DVI plug so there’s no need for a dongle. I tried plugging the monitor into the upper DVI out and get the same result. The default BIOS setting is VGA disabled. I have a 600W PS and once I boot I’m able to run for hours at a time.

Suggestions?

Thanks,

Kerry

All new components:

MOBO: MSI P35D3 (MS-7356) BIOS = v1.1.0.L53
Processor: INTEL Core 2 Duo E6850 3GHz FSB1333MHz 4M LGA775 w/fan
Memory: CORSAIR 2048MB (2x1024MB) DDR3 1066MHz PC8500 Dual-Channel Kit
Hard Drive: Western Digital Raptor 74GB Serial ATA 10,000RPM HDD w/16MB Buffer
CD/DVD drives: PLEXTOR PX-810SA/SW-BL 18X SATA DVD Burner Black DVD±RW
Power Supply: ULTRA X3 600W Energy Efficient Modular ULT40073 Power Supply
Graphics Card: XFX Geforce 8600 GT Fatal1ty 256MB GDDR3 PCI Expr x16 Video Card
OS: Vista Ultimate (32-bit)
ViewSonic 19" LCD

I have removed the board from the case and barebones tested it with the same results.

[xfxsupport]

If you live in North or South America I will be more then happy to arrange and RMA so we can test the video card here, however I dont think this is a video card issue. Have you contacted the motherboard manufacture to see if they have heard of such a situation?

[Kerry]

Hi Tech Support,

I live in Hawaii. I posted a request on the XFX for an RMA, PV-T84J-U1D4 15H 174460 [Ticket Ref: 114346] on 10/23/2007 9:09:42 PM but it's been more than 24 hours with no reply yet.

I have been in constant communication with MSI and they RMA'd the MOBO but that didn't resolve it.

I've tried booting with the MOBO removed from the case and only the PS and graphics card plugged in and got the same result, that's why a MSI HQ Forum member suggested to try booting without the card installed which was the only time it booted successful the second time.

I sure appreciate your offer to RMA the card. What do I need to do? PaulV at XFX was handling the ticket.

Much appreciation,

Kerry

[xfxsupport]

Ok I responded to your ticket and changed the region from Europe to North America/South America. Go ahead and reply to the ticket so we can get this started for you.

[Kerry]

Hi,

I verified my RMA mailing address with Shannon but now I’m not as sure about the card being the source of the problem.

After posting this morning I was able to get a hold of a new Radeon 9250, 256MB, DDR, DVI/Dual Monitor/ TV-Out PCI version.

With the Radeon installed I pressed the start button on the case the fans started for 1-2 seconds and then stopped for 2-3 seconds as before and then the MSI Logo appeared, then the BIOS version and then

CMOS setting Wrong
Date and Time setting wrong
Press F1 to run setup
Press F2 to load default values

I set the date and time and Load Optimized defaults and Save and it booted into Vista successfully.

What was noticeably different is that I didn’t have to press the CMOS button.

I then shut down via Vista’s Shut Down.

Then I pressed the start button again and the fans started for 1-2 seconds and then stopped for 2-3 seconds and then started and the MSI Logo, the BIOS version appeared, and then it booted right through to Vista. AGAIN, I didn’t have to reset the CMOS or re enter the date and time in the BIOS

The final test was to shut down as described and then turn of the power supply strip (which I do evenings) and then start up again I have to Press F1 and set the time and date in the BIOS again.

The big difference between the XFX card and the Radeon card is that with the XFX I have to press the CMOS button to bring up the
CMOS setting Wrong
Date and Time setting wrong
Press F1 to run setup
Press F2 to load default values

whereas with the Radeon I don’t have to. I just have to press F1 and enter the date and time. I repeated this process several times and got the same results.

If I shut down via Vista and then turn off the PS switch I also have to enter the date and time in the BIOS again, but using the Radeon card I don’t have to reset the CMOS.

Confusinger and confusinger.

Here’s hoping you’ve got an answer.

Thanks,

Kerry

[Miker]

It is a MoBo problem, if you lose your time it is probably because the battery is dead or not inserted right.

Just thought of something, is your BIOS RESET JUMPER set to clear? That really sounds like your problem. Clearing everything in BIOS every time you totally power down...

[werty316]

If you loose your time you should also loose your BIOS settings if you changed any.

If the battery on a motherboard dies the BIOS settings stick unless the power cord was unplugged as the stand-by power would still be connected?

[Miker]

"The final test was to shut down as described and then turn of the power supply strip (which I do evenings) and then start up again I have to Press F1 and set the time and date in the BIOS again."

He removes the Back-Up for the battery...

Jumper set to clear BIOS = Clears time and BIOS
Bad Battery = Clears time, leaves BIOS

[werty316]

Well that is why the time and date along with your BIOS setting are reset, its because you shut off your poewr bar.

Leave your poewr bar on when your computer is off you should be fine.

Other than jumping the CMOS I think the BIOS would reset when the motherboard battery is dead/drained and you have the power cord unplugged. If the batery is still good and your computer is plugged into an active power the BIOS shouldn't clear.

[Miker]

BIOS is not like RAM, it doesn't clear with no power. Only thing the battery does it keep the PC Clock Time. Only way for BIOS to reset is with the Jumper.

[werty316]

Doh! I don't know how I got that mixed up :dielaffin:

[Miker]

That isn't as funny as the fan control link.

Kerry, it really sounds like you have a bad MoBo battery. Try replacing it and see if your problem goes away. Also, make sure the BIOS-Reset jumper is not on the Reset way.

[Kerry]

Hi Tech Support:

Just received word from XFX:

[MATT - 11/1/2007 2:57:57 AM] Your recent returns ref: XCR5795 has recently completed the testing process with the following status: {I5H174460 = FAULTY}. A technician will be in contact shortly to discuss completion of this returns. If you have any queries regarding this test result - please send a message to the support team. Thank You. XFX Support Team
I'm relieved that they found it to be faulty and that there's light at the end of this tunnel.

I'm not certain why a technician would need to contact me. I assumed that they would simply RMA a replacement. Could it be they want to offer me a similar/mo betta model? I'd be OK with either option as long as it is Dual-Link so as to display my Dell 30" at max resolution. What I need to know is what would the next best card be? What should I aim for if they want to replace the card with another model? —it's best that I be prepared just in case that's what they want to talk with me about.

Thanks for your support,

Kerry

[tomato]

I wouldn't get your hopes up. There are plenty of 8600 cards to go around. I would imagine that the tech just wants to clear up some paper work or some such.

[werty316]

They'll contact you stating which replacement video card they'll be sending you.

If they don't have that particular model in stock they'll substitute another card of equal or similar performance.

[Kerry]

Thanks all. Will post what happens, especially the end result.

Kerry

[Kerry]

Poop! The card arrived. Different SN:
Identical behavior over a period of ten boots.

Steps:
Turn off power via PS rocker switch
Unplug PS cord
Press CMOS button
plug in cord and turn on power to PS.
Press case start button.
Fans start and stop and restart 2 or 3 times
4 lines of nVidia version etc and then blank screen
repeats for four times
Screen displays CMOS setting wrong, F1, F2, etc.
Set date and time and load optimized defaults and F10
MSI splash screen
Vista loads
Shut down via Vista
Press case start button and I have to repeat the entire process again.

Once I'm in Vista I'm good to go. Because it took two weeks to RMA the XFX card Windows required lots of updates which it did and then prompted reboot to complete installing updates. I opted to reboot and had to do the CMOS dance all over again.
I tried the same process with both my Dell 30" and my ViewSonic 19" LCDs w/same results.

Any suggestions?

Kerry

[Miker]

The only thing I can think of now is a bad PSU... Try another PSU.

[Kerry]

The only thing I can think of now is a bad PSU... Try another PSU.
Thanks Miker, Ultra is looking to see if it could be their PSU and whether or not to issue an RMA.

Kerry

[Miker]

That 24 pin power on you MoBo and sends alot of info to the PSU. The PSU looks like it is not connecting right.

[Kerry]

For others following this thread I received the following reply from BillR on HardForum: This is going to sound funny however I have had it work a number of times now with non boot situations, double boot situations etc. The best part, it’s free and simple.

Turn off your computer, then power down the power supply using either the switch or simply unplugging it. Wait a moment or two and turn the PSU back on but don’t attempt to start the computer. Once you see the lights on the motherboard are on (showing your PSU is working) unplug the 24 pin motherboard connector from the board. (Yes, with the PSU still powered on). After another moment or two plug the 24 pin connector back in. After that then try to power up your computer.

The problem seems to exist primarily with Intel chipsets and multi rail PSUs. Take note that virtually all the big players in the PSU business have been busy switching back to single 12v buss PSUs.

This problem can crop up randomly, after a BIOS flash or reset or even a momentary loss of power to the computer.

To date I’ve done two abit and one msi board with 100% success. I tried it three times and there were two differences. The fans only stopped and started one time with each of the three tries, and, I didn't have to press the CMOS button after Vista shut down for any of the three tries.

I just received the following advice from Curtis at XFX Support:

[CURTIS - 11/15/2007 5:46:00 PM] Dear Kerry this is unusual. Can you test this card in a different system? Your replacement card was tested for full functionality prior to shipping and I do not understand why you are having any of these problems. However if you are using an ATI card in this same system there could be some ATI files interfering. Please DL the latest driver from http://www.nvidia.com/content/drivers/drivers.asp and save them to the desktop. Then download the professional driver cleaner from : http://downloads.guru3d.com/download.php?det=745 and install the cleaner. Uninstall the current video drivers through the add/remove programs utility in the control panel. Reboot into safe mode by pressing F8 repeatedly after the POST screen but before windows loads. Use the driver cleaner to clean only the NVIDIA and ATI(if present) drivers and repeat this step a few times to completely clean the drivers out. Install the latest drivers from the desktop and reboot into windows normally. Also, please make sure that you have the latest motherboard updates such as chipset drivers and BIOS.Curtis I replied:

[You - 11/15/2007 8:02:19 PM] Hi Curtis, The PC I’m using now, my old ASUS P4P800SE, has an AGP slot with a GeForce 7600 GS card. The Radeon card I used for the swap test I borrowed. I don’t have it any more. When testing the boot process with it I did not install any ATI drivers. What causes me to think that the problem is a combination of the P35D3 MOBO and the XFX card is because the system would boot correctly when I tried the Radeon card. I say correctly meaning, the fans would stop and start once but then boot correctly and it didn’t require that I press the CMOS button each time I booted. As mentioned, the RMA’d MOBO came with the latest BIOS v1.1.0.L53. I’ll try the drive cleaner procedure, it will take an hour or so to do, and let you know the results. Have you folks consulted with MSI? Thanks, Kerry

I'm hoping that MSI is following this problem and discovers something and then updates their BIOS. It's presently a beta version (v.1.1.0.L53)

Kerry